Yohanan Aleph (1 John) 5:7-8

Does Yohahan Aleph 5:7-8 support a ‘Trinitarian” doctrine?

Looking at 1John 5:7 (using TS2009) I do not see a Trinitarian doctrine presented, as others might. Verse 8 goes on to explain that the three who bear witness are 1) “the Spirit”, 2) the “Water”, and 3) the “Blood”; and going on to say, “and the three are in agreement.” The “Three who bear witness” in vs. 7 are clearly outlined in vs. 8, therefore if this is some later edition written in support of a Trinitarian Doctrine; it is missing two of the ‘G-d head’, The Father and The Son needed to make a trinity.

The “Spirit”
The ‘Spirit’ is not shown to be another individual, which if so could be a problem since it is the ‘Spirit’ that emanates from Elohim (Heb. Plr. ‘mighty ones’, i.e., Father and Son), to each of us, who must choose daily whether to accept or reject its’ message and contact with us.

The “Water”:
Water, as represented here, is necessary for cleansing, and renewal of body, mind, and spirit. Torah teaches that we must each ‘pass through the water’, both physically and spiritually to cleanse ourselves of anything ‘unclean’ that would cause separation from His Divinity. In Judaism, the ‘mikvah’ (baptismal in xianity) is filled with ‘Living Water’, that one immerses in while in a fetal position, three times. Each time coming up and proclaiming the Words of a Psalm of praise and thanksgiving. It is through this process that it is taught one is ‘born again’ (the original thought developed long before xianity came onto the scene).

The “Blood”:
In Hebraic thought and Scripture, blood contains the ‘Nefesh’ or soul of the one it came from. This is why Scripture counsels us not to eat the blood of an animal because we ingest the ‘soul’ of the beast when we do so. On the other hand, it is the blood of the offering that was sprinkled on all Yisra’el by the High Priest once a year at Yom Kippur (Day of Atonement) for the forgiveness of corporate sin. It is through the blood of the perfect atonement for all mankind in the form of Y’shua Messiah, through His Unspeakable Free Gift, that we may have forgiveness of sin and the will to be obedient to Him and His Commandments; out of love and gratitude for what He has done, is doing, and will do for each of us.


As stated in vs. 8, the ‘three’ are in agreement, that is, they work together in perfect harmony. 1 John 5:7-8 (TS2009) appears to be in full agreement with Torah. Any scribal bias shown through changes to the written Word as seen here would most likely be in support of a Trinitarian doctrine, which, in this case, is not present.

Far and above any debate over these and other texts in the Ketuvim Netzarim (K.N., N.T.), the Tanakh (O.T.), and specifically Torah (first 5 books of the O.T. and our litmus test of any and all spiritual teachings) does not present or support a Trinitarian Doctrine, even though all of the elements are present. If we were to take the approach that the K.N. or N.T. was the proof of itself, we would be guilty of using ‘circular reasoning’, and as such, we would be setting ourselves up to be misled, and/or, to be deceived.

Respectfully, and In His Service

Sha’ul ben haNetzarim



According to Hebraic timekeeping, almost 6,000 years have passed since Adama, and Chava were created, yet a key component of the plan of salvation has in most cases been entirely overlooked, or completely misunderstood by both Christian and Jew. That component as presented here attempts to offer an explanation of the Prophetic Destiny inherent within the Covenant that Elohim made with Abraham; and what it means for us today.


יַעֲקֹב Ya’aqob – Jacob is named יִשְׂרָאֵל Yisra’el by Elohiym upon his return to Canaan from Padanaram. Why? Letting the Torah[1] speak for itself, we find in B’reshı̂yth (Gen.) 35:10-12:

“And  אֱלֹהִים ‘Elôhı̂ym[2][i] said unto him, Thy name is Ya’aqob: thy name shall not be called any more Ya’aqob, but Yisra’el shall be thy name: and he called his name Yisra’el. And El said unto him, I am El Shaddai: be fruitful and multiply; a nation and a company of nations shall be of thee, and kings shall come out of thy loins; and the land which I gave to Avram and Yitzach, to thee I will give it, and to thy seed after thee will I give the land.”

An additional possible explanation of why the name of Ya’acob was changed, comes from an Orthodox Jewish question/answer website, mi yodea:

Braishis 17:19 וַיֹּאמֶר אֱלֹקים אֲבָל שָׂרָה אִשְׁתְּךָ יֹלֶדֶת לְךָ בֵּן וְקָרָאתָ אֶת שְׁמוֹ יִצְחָק thus Yitzchak was named so by Hashem directly.

Avraham was named by his parents who were idolaters. Yaakov was originally named for the fact that he was holding on to Eisav’s heel. By defeating the angel of Eisav he got his new name which showed his superiority.”

This understanding and that of the Avrahamic Covenant are married together in the person of Ya’aqob, and his overall position as being the father of “…a nation and a company of nations…” that were yet to come.

After the incident at the tower of Babel (B’reshiyth 10:1-9), YHVH determined to call out a people who would be separate from all other nations and peoples. This Chosen People would be called to a higher standard of holiness, and would worship Him only, They would be obedient to His Everlasting Torah, safeguarding and preserving it, while causing its’ light to shine outward into a world of darkness, so that “…all families of the earth…” would be blessed!.

This calling was accepted without question by Avraham, Yitzach, and Ya’aqob; the Patriarchs of Yisra’el, who carried with them the Covenant of Physical Multiplicity as seen in the following scriptural references found in Be’reshiyth:

12:2,3 “And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing: And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.”

13:16 “And I will make thy seed as the dust of the earth: so that if a man can number the dust of the earth, then shall thy seed also be numbered.”

15:5 “And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him, so shall thy seed be.”

17:2-8 “And I will make my covenant between me and thee, and will multiply thee exceedingly. And Abram fell on his face; and Elohim talked with him, saying, As for me, behold, my covenant is with thee, and thou shalt be a father of many nations. Neither shall thy name any more be called Avram, but thy name shall be Avraham; for a father of many nations have I made thee. And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be Elohim unto thee, and to thy seed after thee. And I will give unto thee, and to thy seed after thee, the land wherein thou art a stranger, all the land of Canaan, for an everlasting possession; and I will be their Elohim.

22:17-18 “…in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies. And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice.”

Have you ever noticed, that when YHVH wants us to take note of something, it will be repeated more than once? Here we have a  Covenant promise made with Avram, passed to Yitzach, passed to Ya’aqob (Yisra’el); on through the 12 Tribes of Yisra’el, down through punishments and captivity, deportation and assimilation; confirmed by the Nevi’im (Prophets) with its’ fruition seen “in that day[3]”, was one of physical multiplicity; that his ‘seed’ would become as the stars of the heaven and the sand which is on the seashore (friend, that’s a lot of people!):

This little noticed prophetic Covenant Promise, with such far-reaching, and astounding conclusions, has been hidden right in front of us all the time. If we follow them on through His Word they will take us from the time of Abram, all the way to the Second Coming of HaMashiyach and beyond!

Who can “count the dust”? Who can “count the stars”? Who can count the sand on every seashore? Why these challenges can not be answered by a mortal man, can they? There is but One who can, and who has answered all of them and more in His Word!

Even the best of our Astronomers, with the world’s best and most expensive equipment placed out in space as far as any such thing has ever been, cannot count the stars, can they? They haven’t found an end to the Heavens, have they? And the thought of counting the sand on the seashore, really? And if you thought that would be easy, how about counting the dust? Why if it could be done, every star, every grain of sand, every minute particle of dust across the world would have to be counted. The number would be astronomical! Of course, none of these choices are humanly possible. Elohim is telling us something very special about the covenant of physical multiplicity made with Avraham.


[1]  תּוֹרָה Torah, from the Hebrew root יָרָה  yârâh,  Is Hebraicly understood as Teaching or Instruction. This word does not translate into the English word ‘Law’, as many have been mislead or mistaught. However, Torah contains a total of 613 Laws that can be further divided into Commandments, Ordinances, and Judgements. Not all pertain to everyone, everywhere.

[2] אֱלֹהִים ‘Elôhı̂ym. As found in in HaSefer Torah, is a plural masculine form of the singular El, and as such means more than one El. This begs the question since we know YHVH is echad (One) D’varim (Dt.) 6:4, who is the other One, or One’s that complete the Plurality, and does your answer come from the Tanakh? If the answer does not come from the Tanakh, it is not acceptable as a valid proof.

[3] A common prophetic referral to the time when all things past, present, and future come together at the return of Y’shua HaMashiyach. Such a glorious day all the World has been waiting for! Come quickly we pray Master Y’shua!